Bringing Water to the Desert, Part Two

Judge Debra Sasser, a white woman with brown hair and brown glasses, wears a purple blouse and pale purple jacket. By Judge Debra Sasser

Welcome to Part Two of the six-part video series, “Bringing Water to the Desert.”

In Part One, “Bringing Water to the Desert (on a Horse With No Name),” Judge Vince Rozier (Resident Superior Court Judge in the Tenth Judicial District) and Judge Beth Tanner (District Court Judge in the Twenty-Ninth Judicial District) began a conversation on how attorney shortages in legal deserts negatively impact the ability of the State to provide court-appointed attorneys.

There is no doubt that the income from court-appointed representation falls far below what attorneys earn from privately retained clients.[1] But an increase in IDS rates would only address one of the issues affecting participation on the court-appointed lists.

In Part Two of this video series, Judge Tanner and Judge Rozier discuss some of the approaches they have implemented and case management techniques they have observed that encourage attorney participation on the court appointed list — such as no (or low) cost ways to show appreciation to private appointed counsel and simple case management protocols that result in more efficient use of time for all attorneys and stakeholders.

Judge Debra S. Sasser served as a District Court Judge in Wake County from 2004 until her retirement from the bench on January 1, 2025. An expanded legal bio is available in the blog post accompanying Part One of this series.

[1] In North Carolina, private appointed counsel are paid by the Office of Indigent Services (“IDS”), which is charged with managing the legal representation of indigent defendants and others entitled to court-appointed representation. IDS determines the most appropriate and cost-effective methods for delivering these legal services. For private appointed counsel who are paid an hourly rate, the rate ranges from $65 per hour to $100 per hour, depending on the type of case and nature of the criminal charges.

Although salaries vary widely across the country, depending on location and size of the law firm, the median annual salary for a first-year associate is $200,000, roughly triple the median salary for a first-year lawyer in a public defender’s office. See the American Bar Association Profile of the Legal Profession 2024 (November 2024).

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